Question: Which pantheon is hardest on humanity from birth to death and beyond?
Hmm. That's an interesting question, and an inherently subjective one; every culture has different expectations of what's good and what isn't, and every set of gods expects different things from their mortals based on that, so while the Norse might think that getting gruesomely murdered in battle so you can have a nice afterlife is totally kosher, other cultures might find that more than a little unfair. A lot of it has to do with who's judging what's "hardest" and by what criteria.
As far as life itself goes, I'd probably vote for the Anunna. Babylonian mythology specifically states that humans were invented to do all the grunt work and shitty jobs so the gods could relax and hang out in their palatial Overworld mansions. It's a whole religion founded on the idea that humanity is unpaid slave labor for the gods, and that if your life sucks, well, that's kind of how it is because it's your job to endure the sucky stuff so they don't have to. Add to that the general Anunna attitude that all humans are ants who don't dare approach the gods even for help (read a Babylonian prayer some time... it's like ten minutes of talking about how awesome the god is, ten minutes of apologizing for bothering them, ten minutes of admitting the lack of worthiness of the supplicant, and then a closing ten minutes of thanking them for letting the supplicant call to tell them how great they are. And that's the gods that you're allowed to pray to), and you have a pantheon that is kind of just a bag of dicks to humanity. A powerful, culture-granting bag of dicks, but a bag of dicks nevertheless.
As far as death and the afterlife go, nobody is really a happy fun time all around; even those cultures that do have nice places to go when you die (Raj for the Slavs, Valhalla for the Norse, the Isle of the Blessed for the Greeks) usually have an accompanying depressing pit of sadness to go along with them (Nav, Hel, Tartarus, etc). I think a good contender for the most brutal to humanity is probably Di Yu, which is basically a gigantic prison complex of hells designed for the express purpose of ruthlessly torturing dead people until they're deemed fit for reincarnation. Of course, this is all in the name of rehabilitation, so we should probably be grateful for things like the Mountain of Knives and the Room of Grinding. Delightful.
I think this might be a question that's different for everyone; some might find the Aztlanti the hardest on mortals, what with demanding blood sacrifice all the time, or the Yazata, with their insane purification rites and shunnings, or still others. Some might think the prospect of eventual reincarnation makes Di Yu better than being locked forever in Irkallu or potentially consigned to oblivion in Ammit's maw.
And, of course, when it's happening to you, whomever's doing it is always the worst. It's all a matter of perspective.
I thought the Elohim Underworld sounded the absolute worst. You live in a world of mud and disease forever and ever, and that's if you even MAKE IT PAST THE MUCK and don't get SWALLOWED WHOLE in the process?
ReplyDeleteHow awful. I'd rather deal with the worst hell if the reward is eventual reincarnation, over THAT.
The Bog of Eternal Snot isn't a very exciting eternal vacation resort, is it?
Deletesame here. punishment and reincarnation are preferable to some of the nasty underworlds of the ancient middle eastern gods. what gets me is that all souls, both good and evil end up there. While that gives a certain equality it gives testament to the gods car of there people if they can't spring for a half decent resting place other than an eternal swamp or dreary prison. That's why I think the Elohim are the hardest. They require sacrifices that would make the Azlanti flinch then send them to the snot bog anyway. My favorite has to be the Tuatha. Does everyone go to mag mell, or is there a punishment zone for bad Irish men?
DeleteBut don't forget that the Elohim can (at least in Scion according to Anne and John) take favored mortals Tagarit, probably either by favor brokering with Mot or if they decide to transplant some pretty city-kingdom that they've been working on via Malak. Anne has Hannibal chilling out in Platonic Carthage, for instance, and Dido WOULD be there if it weren't for Mot.
DeleteMan, I wrote a response to this last night and only realized this morning that it somehow didn't post. Stupid Blogger.
DeleteEverybody does not get to go to Mag Mell; just like Valhalla, it's reserved only for those most badass and awesome of Irish warriors who earn their way there. Everybody else goes to Tech Duinn, the general Irish Underworld, overseen by the death-god Donn. Donn is also the ancestor of the Irish people, according to myth, so from him the people came and to him they must inevitably return. Tech Duinn is definitely said to be underground, and the people who go there are required to pay homage to Donn as their new liege, but beyond that the scraps of pre-Christian Irish literature left don't have a lot of specifics for us to go on, sadly.
I didn't mention Nepesh mostly because, while everything in it is based in Canaanite myth as much as I could make it, the area's underworld legends are a little vague and I did have to use some of my own interpretations as well (it's certainly down the throat of Mot, certainly said to be sticky, unpleasant and "moist", and certainly a place nobody likes being with a city in it that nobody wants to go to, but some other features have been embellished). Just didn't want to be misrepresentin'. :)
I agree, though, Nepesh as written for Scion is just the worst ever.
This reminds me, I am kind of curious who ends up where in Modern times. I would find a bunch of suicide bombers in valhalla hilarious for example.
ReplyDeleteWe usually rule that they would probably end up in the Underworld of whomever's territory they're in - people who die in Sweden probably still go to Hel or Valhalla, people who die in Japan have the delights of Yomi to look forward to, and so on. If someone dies abroad but has a particularly storng connection to a pantheon - is actually a worshiper of theirs, or is purely ethnically tied to them, or ever interacted (even unknowingly) with a divine being from over there - then they might end up in that pantheon's Underworld even if they kicked the bucket far from home.
DeleteStupid suicidal bravery probably totally still gets you to Valhalla!
In your opinion where would an American Buddhist go? One of the generally caucasian variety?
Deletewow, I can only imagine suicide bombers blowing themselves up in Iraq and ending up in Irkallu. Surprise assholes!
DeleteI think that's mentioned in the books. I recall it being at least touched upon, if not outright addressed. Mind you, aside from the mechanics and character creation sections I've only skimmed the books (normally don't ST for Scion, so it's not that urgent for me to read them), so I can't be 100% sure.
ReplyDeleteI have the same vague, misty memory of that.
DeleteEverybody seems to run where modern mortals end up differently.