Tuesday, August 27, 2013

Be Yourself

Question: When A PC creates a character from, for example, the Dodekatheon, and let's say he's the son of Poseidon but really doesnt use any of Poseidon's purviews, how do you feel about that character? If the character makes a good argument about why he is taking certain purviews, would they be accepted? For example, a son/daughter of Poseidon uses the Frost purview and perhaps War and very minimally uses Water, but wanted Arete, and explains that they want to personify the Wrath of Poseidon. What would you say?

We had another question like this recently, but I'm answering both because it seems like a fairly common place where new players and Storytellers get confused. We would feel just fine about that character, and we would accept whatever reasons he had for wanting particular power, and we would say go have a blast, do what you wanna do!

I recently had a conversation with someone who was turned off on even playing Scion because she was confused about this, so let me bold it and tell you the happy news: nobody ever has to do the same things their parents do. That means you don't have to be the same kind of character - not the same sex, the same profession, the same goals, the same personality, or the same powers - in any way if you don't want to. You could create any character you wanted completely in a vacuum, and then assign them to any divine parent in the entire game, and that would be completely fine.

That means that if you happen to be the daughter of Thor, you know what? You don't have to have any thunder powers. You also don't have to be strong, brave, or interested in fighting monsters. You can do those things if you want to, and you have an advantage to doing so because you're coming from the blood of Thor, but if you want to be a withdrawn bookworm who likes hairdressing as a hobby and put all her points into powers over art and fire, nobody can tell you no. You are free to take literally any powers from day one of creating a character.

So if your character wants to be a Scion of Poseidon with Frost and War instead of Earth and Water, my friend, you can do that! We don't even require you to come up with a reason you have those powers instead of the ones your dad has; "this is what I want to do with my character" is usually good enough for us. We like it if you come up with a backstory reason that this happened - for example, you could say that your War relic came from Ares, who was helping Poseidon gear you up - and this is something some Storytellers insist on, but in the end it's just window-dressing. If you don't tell us where those powers came from and we decide that it's important to the story for some reason, we'll figure it out as Storytellers and you may or may not discover it at a later date.

The only actual mechanical difference between wielding powers your parents use and wielding powers outside their wheelhouse is that you get an XP discount on your parent's powers, to represent that Fire or Charisma or Moon runs particularly strong in their veins and hence in yours. But, aside from the pantheon-specific powers of pantheons other than your own, there are no powers you aren't allowed to have, no areas of symbolism you aren't allowed to explore.

Nobody making new characters should ever feel like they have to be clones of their parents; in fact, we prefer it when Scions are their own individual personalities and don't necessarily conform to their parents' image or ideals. After all, until recently they were normal humans who had their own lives, thoughts and personalities, and it's totally up to you as the player how much they might have taken after their parents, from "all the way" to "not at all". You don't have to be just like your parent, and you don't have to use powers just like your parent; in fact, many children of gods in mythology don't. Heracles never shows the slightest inclination toward using Sky or Justice even though he's a son of Zeus, nor does Cu Chulainn turn up with any craftsmanship skills or bright lights despite being Lugh's spawn.

Of course, if you want to play a thundery archer-warrior son of Indra, that's totally awesome, too - you also should never feel like you're not allowed to do the same things as your parent! Scion is a game where you literally choose your path and powers almost completely freeform.

So play your Scion of Poseidon. He can be anything he wants, and if that's frostiness and fighting instead of dolphins and earthquakes, he should go forth and wrath all the way into the wintery sunset.

30 comments:

  1. Not the question asker, but something slightly related.
    Do you let your players to come up with Relics for their characters? do you design them working with the player in question? or do you decide what their Relics are, and what powers they give?

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    1. At the beginning of a story I have a LOT of work to do. I really dont have time to do much with relics. I count on pcs to know most of the stuff about their relics and I help tweek them and balance them after they're done. I do much more work on demigod and then god relics. They happen mid story so I have more planning time to devote to t hem.

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  2. okay completely unrelated question, where did you get the art for Zoe. I could swear I've seen it before but I can't remember.

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    1. Its a super secret. If you can figure it out though, you'd be amazing.

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    2. Or you could do a Google Image Search...;p

      But I'll let Tom figure it out himself :)

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    3. holy crap I found it... well... I found a much redder version of this picture at least.

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    4. You found it :)
      Anne did the alter

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    5. YEEESS! Now while we're not on the subject. Isaac Green & Russel Pride, who are their divine parents and when can we expect there character sheets?

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    6. Take guesses from the info provided and I'll answer after a bit.
      Anne does the character sheets. She is pretty exhausted from her 12 hour days since school started, so I couldnt tell you when they'll be up.

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    7. Zoe might be my new favorite character...but that's just because I'm excited to see Anne play a Scion of Zeus! (and she has the same name as my sister I guess)

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    8. Your sister has an excellent name.

      I'm excited about her, too!

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    9. I have a very hard time not seeing the muppet :)

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  3. You can also remove the XP penalty for favored epics and purviews, and give some other benefit for being favored instead.

    This way your players do not feel like they are being punished for not being carbon copies of their parents. I've run into too many situations where players became frustrated or felt like they couldn't 'keep up' with other players who picked a concept that had more favored things than their concept.

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    1. That defeats the point of everything.

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    2. And Ive never come into that problem ever. Just like ive never come up to it in any other system that uses xp discounts for certain things.

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    3. Naaah, you might think it defeats the point of everything but in actual practice it works out great. There still has to be some kind of benefit, whatever the storyteller decides that should be.

      I know one ST who gives a couple of bonus successes on favored things. Another ST that gives you a little bit of free legend every game towards your favored things. A third ST that just makes any fatebonds to your favored things slightly more powerful.

      I don't necessarily agree with all of those things, but it's a big relief to get away from the XP penalty model.

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    4. There is NEVER an xp penalty. You are getting an xp discount. I do not understand this logic at all. No one ever thought it was an xp penalty when vampires tried to get out of clan boons.
      And how are any of those things different then an xp discount on some powers? They all have the same end result. You are naturally better at the powers your parents are better at. Nothing changes except the mode of that power influx.

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    5. Yeah, I'm always confused by people who say there's an XP "penalty" to not being like your parent. There isn't; in fact, there are no XP penalties in the game at all except for the one that makes your PSP more expensive if you swap out Virtues.

      If you don't buy your parents' powers, you're just paying normal price for everything; their powers are discounted. You're not being taxed, you're paying the normal amount, which is something most people do for most stats. To view it as some kind of punishment is completely ass-backwards.

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    6. I think they're viewing it as a zero-sum system relative to the other PCs, where if PC A is buying associated stuff, and PC B isn't, PC B is somehow being penalized because relative to PC B, PC A is getting more bang for his buck.

      Except, like Anne said, it's kind of backwards to call one person's discount/bonus a penalty just because your character isn't getting the same. I'd go so far as to add the word "entitled" onto it myself. It's meant to represent innate tendencies towards those abilities/purviews, such that you can learn them faster/easier - not make you better at them.

      And you don't even need to choose to go down that road if you don't want. The only "penalty" then is spending the same time/effort as is normal for everyone else, unless they happen to have that favored and are pursuing it. If so, good for them I guess?

      I don't understand your logic, anon.

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    7. It's human nature to look at a 'discount' and see the more expensive thing as a 'penalty'. Unfortunately for logic, feeling bad because you are getting a 'penalty' compared to other players is an issue of emotion. And feeling that way does not make them bad people who should be shamed for their feelings.

      The differences vary from one ST to the next. Getting a couple of bonus successes does not sit as well with me, because it is still a tangible benefit, but I suppose it plays with psychology a little bit and feels more like a 'discount'.

      Getting a couple of free legend feels the most liberating to me, just because you only need one favored to make use of it. More favored epics and purviews just give you more options, not more power. This would only really hurt for characters that take no favored epics or purviews.

      The fatebond example I saw one ST use meant you gained bonuses to your favored epics and purviews faster, but also gained penalties faster. This was a little more nebulous to judge, but it was fun to experience as a player.

      Of course, I can think of a dozen more possibilities but those three are the only ones I have real world, in game experience playing with.

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    8. I don't know if we can say human nature - after all, there are some people in this thread who obviously don't feel that way, and they're human, too. But it's certainly something that some players apparently feel like, and you're right, that's not something to try to shame them for. That wasn't my intent, by the way, anon, and I'm sorry if it came off that way.

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    9. Yeah. It goes without saying that everyone is going to be different, and feel different. It would be an ideal world if everyone could look different 'prices' and think of the higher one as normal and the lower one as nothing but savings.

      But I know enough people who don't feel that way. And hopefully some of the examples I listed may help the OP and other people reading to give some of them a try, and see for themselves if it raises morale. :)

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    10. Bullshit. What you're saying has nothing to do with the OP. The OP is worried that they wont be socially accepted and at no point mentions giving a damn about points or xp.

      And yes...I do wish we lived in an ideal world where everyone had simple logic as an inherent trait....

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    11. Yes, you're a big grumpy wolverine. We get it. :P

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    12. The problem, Anonymous, seems to be that the versions you've played with circumvent the mechanics of the game because you've played with whiny players. I'd shoot myself if i had to play in a game like that.

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    13. A few of them were whiny, and not the kind of players you would want to play with. But most of them were genuinely good people who just don't like feeling bad. A few of them were some of the best roleplayers I have ever had the honor of sharing a game with.

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  4. Thanks for clearing that up, I'm going to look into actually playing the game instead of just reading other peoples stories.

    (... Thinking of it, should I check out any books besides the "Core" Hero, Demigod, God.)

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    1. Sounds awesome - playing is the most fun!

      It depends on what you want. Companion has a lot of very messy powers and mechanics, but it also includes three pantheons - the Tuatha, Devas and Celestial Bureaucracy - that you may want to investigate. The Yazata and Nemetondevos supplements are the same story. Ragnarok is all Norse so not a lot of new materials, but is the best-executed of the books, in our opinion.

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  5. (The question asker) Thank you so much again for answering my question, (was also the Donation question asker in the "Lovefest" and "Doing it yourself" question. You all have literally made it so easy to get around so many questions i've had, this site has made my current game of scion so much fun. My character is infact a son of Poseidon who uses war and frost mostly. and your knacks for Parry have made it so much more fun since i dont have to be so dexteritous (characters a grappler). I honestly have to say I would probably not have become such a huge fan of scion with just playing it alone. Watching your vlogs and reading the blog page along side the fiction page, has kept me interested. Thank you all for all your hard work and again thank you for answering my questions. (PS if your ever looking for a player that is willing to drive down to NC like twice a month Im your man lol) Anywho let me get you guys back to what you are up to.

    Again thanks and Take care

    Marcel "Syprix" Fontanez.

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